[MBT] Massive Battery of Tests Apr 25, 2017, 3:38 PM
zombie33 I will introduce you the MBT  : The massive battery of tests.

This is the second MBT of peasant (you can see results of the first one from 2013 here. Some voluntiers will play a high number of game with predefine decks in order to determine the best decks of the format and the good or bad match up of every decks. Everyone can participate to this MBT.


Phase 1  :
* Debate to define the main decklist of 5 archetypes of the format  :
Faeries, Wellspring, Affinity Atog, MBC Devotion, UB Thopter
* Playtests main deck with the 5 list define previously - every match at least 10 times OTP and OTD (200 games)

Phase 2  :
* Debate to define the main decklist of 5 other archetypes of the format  :
MGA, Burn, MWC, Arcane Tide, Gx Tron
* Playtests main deck with the 10 list define previously (700 games)

Phase 3  :
* Update some decklist or add some new deck to the MBT.
* Think about the best Sideboard for each decklist.


MBT - Google Doc


The google doc contain three sheet :
- Data (playtest)  : This is where every gamer will fill the google doc with results.
- MBT results  : Table of statistics and results
- Specific deck  : More informations related to a specific deck, this is where you can find the decklist used for each deck.
last page
B4L4 May 10, 2017, 11:40 AM Burn :
I don't get the synergy between "play during the end step of my opponent" & Kiln Fiend, as the power boost will be lost during your turn. If you really want to clear the way for Kiln, Searing Blaze at least serves double duty (remove a blocker + dmg to the opponent).

I disagree with the statement "it the same for Monastery Swiftspear". Kiln Fiend will get to attack at best on turn 3. Swiftspear can attack T1 & T2, where there is less blockers to face. And the haste on Swiftspear can suprise players, even in later turns of the game.

Arcane Tide :

Brainstorm is a draw 3 instant card which is to be used at the end step of the opponent turn before the big turn


Please don't play Brainstorm that way unless you are in a really, really desperate situation :-(. I cannot stress enough how wrong it is to play Brainstorm the way you suggest.

Hitting 3 lands on the first 3 turns needs drawing cards, not shuffling ones in my opinion.

.
Hum, I am not sure we are on the same page here. Pieces of the Puzzle, Peer Through Depths, 2nd copies of Dampen Thought & Stream of Consciousness are not going to give you the lands you need in the first turns. Ponder does. Ponder doesn't always have to be used in shuffle mode. But for instance, Ponder let's you see almost 4 cards when you look at the top 3 + suffle. No other 1ccm cards let you dig that deep.
GalacticPresident May 10, 2017, 11:44 AM @knightseb: Thanks for your input! I'm afraid your burn list isn't quite the strongest possible. I absolutely recommend you to try out Thermo-Alchemist with more 1 mana burn spells (trading a couple of Chain Lightnings will be worth it!). The problem with Kiln Fiend is, if you use burnspells to clear blockers, you don't get more damage in than the burnspell itself would have done. But the fail case (if the opponent kills it or has more blockers than you can kill) it suddenly becomes your worst card. As it has been said already, the Burn deck is about consistency and interchangeability. You want a very low number of situational cards and the maximum amount of direct damage. Thermo-Alchemist is also a card that can be killed before it does any damage (fail case), but it can't be blocked, has more thoughness than Kiln Fiend and can deal huge amounts of damage.
4 Shrine seem bad due to the number of artifact hate everywhere as you said yourself.
knightseb May 10, 2017, 2:48 PM @GalacticPresident : I know that my list isn't the strongest available at the moment. It was just here to illustrate my words and I agree it isn't up to date. I will try Thermo Alchemist in the near future.

@B4l4 : For Burn, I hear your statements and I know that my list isn't up to date. Changes will be done to my deck list soon with the inputs of this debate .
For Arcane tide, having 8-9 cards in hand at the beginning of the big turn is best than having only 7. Of course, i won't play Brainstorm this way if i don't want to start the combo the following turn ... For ponder, when I played it, I preferred Preordain ou Serum visions to get my lands in the first turns. Moreover, I always been careful of my starting hand and to mulligan or not to get more lands. Maybe I was lucky, maybe ponder doesn't suit my style but don't considerate me as a beginner with the deck. I will never play Pieces of the puzzle, Peer throught depths, Ideas unbound unless I have enough lands to go wild or to sculpt my hand in order to prepare the big turn.
zombie33 May 10, 2017, 2:56 PM Pieces of the puzzle is a very important card of Arcane Tide, the more you play it the less you are sensible to Duress/Hymn to Tourach.
knightseb May 10, 2017, 3:05 PM I agree. It wouldn't make sense to me to play less than 4 of them.
B4L4 May 10, 2017, 3:50 PM @knightseb, I am not saying you are a beginner with the deck, I was just surprised by some of your sentences, for example regarding the use of Brainstorm or Ponder.

Pieces of the Puzzle is indeed very important for Arcane Tide and I am sold on the fact that your 75 should contain 4 of them.
But I am still not sure that the playset should be MD. If your meta consist of fast aggro / combo / linear decks, 4 Pieces MD is a burden. Playing 4 MD decrease our T4 win %tage when comparing with the 4 Ponder version (in my experience at least). And given how little interaction Arcane Tide has to offer to fast decks, I'd rather have the highest T4 win %tage.
But if you expect a meta full of MBD, Thopter, The Rack, etc, then go for 4 Pieces.

For Arcane tide, having 8-9 cards in hand at the beginning of the big turn is best than having only 7.


I think we all agree on that. I just don't understand your point here.

Serum visions


That may very well be the worst cantrip available for Arcane Tide. I rate Sleight of Hand higher.

I will never play Pieces of the puzzle, Peer throught depths, Ideas unbound unless I have enough lands to go wild or to sculpt my hand in order to prepare the big turn.


Not quite sure to understand here either. There are no defined good or bad times to play those cards, it is always pretty situational. For example :
- Pieces is generally played as soon as you have 3 manas available (big turn or not), unless you need to find a specific card, in which case Scroll/Peer + Cantrip might be a better use of your 3 mana.
- Peer & Unbound can be played at any point of the game too (sculpting, hitting desperate land-drops with Unbound, big turn, etc...).

I am glad we are discussing decklists, hearing different points of view is always welcomed.
B4L4 May 10, 2017, 4:13 PM Another note on Ponder :
You are not 100% sure to see more lands during your big turn in a Ponder version, here is why :
- Sequencing matters : You have a lot of ways to use ponder to grab the 1/2 best cards on top, then clear the jank (Scroll, Peer, Dampen, Pieces, etc...).
- Ponder versions usually play 18 lands vs 19 for versions with 3+ Pieces & some number of DA in the MD (see : http://mtg-peasant.com/top8/588/1/). That's one less land to care about.

In the version you suggested previously, you run 18 lands with 61 cards MD and only BS & Preordain as cheap cantrips. We are entering the danger zone in term of hitting 3 lands on the third turn (53.27% on the play if we don't take cantrip into account) (see : https://tinyurl.com/lsx79ux)
B4L4 May 10, 2017, 4:25 PM At the end of the day, we have to remember that we are discussing "the best" version of each deck for the Massive Battery of Tests, where anyone willing to contribute can pick and play a deck.

The 4 Ponder version might not be the best or not the easiest one to play for non-regular pilots of the deck. I just wanted to highlight some of its benefits.
Toufmade May 10, 2017, 4:34 PM For Elf
I agree to cut 1 Multany.
It's not a problem if Imperious become an Gaea's Anthem even if I'm still thinking that Imperious is better. Both are close in my mind.

I think cut the third Might is a bad ideas. But it's just 1 slot, so it's not a problem.

For High tide
Ok

For MWC
Monument is a good idea. I don't know how to change properly the build. But it's a nice possibility.

For Burn
I don't have any idea. I don't like play it (So I rarely play it). But I know that Moldavien playtested it a lot. And his list seems good.

For MGA
I like the list. But I think 4 Vines is necessary. I'll play it over the second Hunger.

Infect
I play Blossoming defense over Mental Misstep, but it's just an opinion
Max2070 May 10, 2017, 4:43 PM 4 Vines is necessary